Climate Change and Health Seminar: "Vulnerability of Latino/a & indigenous immigrants to climate disasters: case study of the Thomas Fire in California"

Name: Climate Change and Health Seminar: "Vulnerability of Latino/a & indigenous immigrants to climate disasters: case study of the Thomas Fire in California"
Uploaded: 2020-12-02T17:58:48.387Z
Duration: 58 min 46 s
Description: Dr. Michael Méndez; Assistant Professor - School of Social Ecology, University of California Irvine Dr. Michael Méndez joined the Yale Center on Climate Change and Health's seminar series to speak on his work with the Latino/a and indigenous communities affected by wildfires in California. November 30, 2020

December 02, 2020

Dr. Michael Méndez; Assistant Professor - School of Social Ecology, University of California Irvine

Dr. Michael Méndez joined the Yale Center on Climate Change and Health's seminar series to speak on his work with the Latino/a and indigenous communities affected by wildfires in California.

November 30, 2020

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ID: 5954
To Cite: DCA Citation Guide

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00:01- So, hi everyone,
00:02welcome to join us
00:03and thank you for your patience
00:05and welcome to the Yeltsin town country
00:09to the house seminar,
00:10I'm today's moderator, Kai Chen,
00:13Assistant Professor
00:14at the Yale School of Public Health.
00:16If you have any questions during the presentation,
00:19please use the chat box
00:22and the speaker will answer them
00:24at the end of the seminar.
00:26So today, we're very pleased
00:28to have Dr. Michael Mendez join us
00:32who will talk about the vulnerabilities
00:35of Latino communities
00:37during the Thomas Fire in California.
00:40So Dr. Mendez is an Assistant Professor
00:44at the School of Social Ecology
00:47of the University of California, Irvine.
00:51So he has more than a decade experience
00:55in the public and private sectors
00:57and he was recently appointed
01:00by the National Academy of Science,
01:02Engineering and Medicine
01:04to the board on on Environmental Change
01:07and Society.
01:09He recently has a new book published
01:11by the Yale press
01:14named "Climate Change from the Streets",
01:17which provides an urgent and timely analysis
01:21of the continuous policies
01:24of incorporating environmental justice
01:27into global climate change process.
01:29So without further ado,
01:31I'm handing over to Dr. Michael Mendez
01:34and looking forward to his talk.
01:37- Great, good morning.
01:38Thank you, such a pleasure to be back at Yale
01:40at least through Zoom.
01:42So thank you to Robert
01:44and everyone with the Climate and Health Center
01:47at the Yale School Public Health
01:50and sorry, I'm a little bit late,
01:52I got mixed up with the time so but I'm happy.
01:54It's online when I got the email.
01:57So today I'm gonna be talking
01:59about some research I actually started
02:01at the Yale School of the Environment,
02:02I'm looking at the "Disparate Impacts
02:04of Wildfires on Undocumented Immigrants"
02:07and specifically looking at "Lessons
02:09on Inclusive Disaster
02:10and Climate Adaptation Planning",
02:14so as many of you know, in California,
02:16over the last four or five months,
02:19we have been experiencing
02:20major climate change crises
02:23and in the last two months alone,
02:25millions of people have been impacted by fires,
02:28blackouts, heat waves, worsening air quality
02:32and of course, the ever present COVID-19 pandemic
02:35and of course, loss of life and property.
02:38These are all major life events
02:40and the five of the 10 largest wildfires
02:44by acreage ever recorded in California
02:47occurred within the last three months.
02:50These compounds of disaster
02:52have a corresponding health,
02:54social and economic impacts to people,
02:56especially people of color
03:00and these individuals have suffered multiple weeks
03:03of unhealthy air,
03:05and that has been worsening throughout California.
03:08So today, I'm gonna be speaking
03:09about some of the research that I did,
03:11I co-authored it with community based organizations
03:14on immigrant rights group,
03:16a migrant rights group
03:17as well as an environmental justice group
03:19that were on the front lines
03:20during the 2018 Thomas wildfire,
03:25so our presentation is gonna talk
03:26about how these individuals
03:29on these community groups stepped up
03:31when there was no official government response
03:33for undocumented immigrant communities.
03:35So these individuals were rendered invisible,
03:39not because they live in the shadows,
03:41not because people didn't know they were there
03:43but they're rendered invisible
03:44because of systemic racism
03:46and cultural norms of who's considered
03:49a worthy disaster victim
03:51and oftentimes, undocumented immigrants
03:54are not considered worthy disaster victims,
03:55therefore, they're rendered invisible
03:57and important resources,
03:59government resources, disaster relief,
04:02therefore is withheld from them,
04:04which makes them more vulnerable
04:06to disasters such as wildfires.
04:10So it's important to understand
04:11that Disaster Risk Reduction starts first
04:14and foremost with social integration of migrants.
04:18I just mentioned that
04:19how these migrants were undocumented immigrants
04:22were rendered invisible
04:23because of systemic racism
04:24and cultural norms
04:25of who they were they disaster victim,
04:27so if you bring in undocumented immigrant,
04:30if you really wanna address Disaster Risk Reduction
04:33before disaster you have
04:34to acknowledge the existing inequalities
04:36that undocumented immigrants experience
04:39their pre-disaster marginalized status
04:42and try to integrate
04:43and reduce those inequalities
04:45before disaster happens
04:47because when a disaster happens,
04:49that compounds in exasperates existing inequality
04:53so the point is to understand
04:54their pre-disaster marginalized status,
04:59as I mentioned before,
05:00this is some research that, first
05:02that was recently published by Geoforum,
05:05which is the leading human geography
05:07on journal in the field
05:09and we call it "the Invisible Victims of Disaster"
05:13and I chose a community based on research project
05:17and giving the migrant rights group
05:19and environmental justice groups authorship
05:21of this research
05:23and we worked jointly and collaboratively
05:25on the research questions,
05:26the data and of course, the analysis
05:28and throughout the publication.
05:34Oh, my God, this is the older version.
05:39So I just wanna show you some issues
05:43about disaster recovery resources here,
05:47this is an outline,
05:51that minus one of the assembly members
05:53where my parents live in Sylmar, California
05:55which is in the northeast part of Los Angeles
05:59and Sylmar, California
06:00is the working class immigrant community
06:03but it's important to note here
06:04when you go for disaster assistance of funds,
06:09you need to have a social security number
06:11and you need to have a bank account
06:12to receive federal disaster relief funds.
06:14Undocumented immigrants are not eligible to that,
06:18my parents, luckily are now US citizens
06:22they are homeowners.
06:23So their vulnerability is very different
06:25on the other Latino migrant communities.
06:29So oftentimes in disaster relief funding and practices,
06:34these ideas of Latinos
06:36being homogenous is integrated into policies
06:39and it does not effectively address
06:43all the issues that are happening
06:45to these communities.
06:46For example, these are some headlines
06:48that have happened over the year
06:50the Kincade Fire,
06:51which is in Northern California,
06:52Sonoma and Napa area,
06:54it talks about how farm workers had to flee
06:56from their houses, from the worker camps
06:59that they lived without gas
07:00and had to make shift shelters
07:03on nearby beaches and other parks
07:07because they were afraid to go to
07:08on the designated shelters that the county
07:10and local governments did
07:12for fear of deportation of ice,
07:15the Homeland Security coming in
07:16and taking them as well.
07:17There's also issues with language access.
07:22Oftentimes, when you talk
07:24about undocumented immigrants
07:26that are coming from Latin America,
07:27you think they're all Latino or Hispanic
07:30but a lot of them are indigenous,
07:32there were indigenous Mexicans
07:34or indigenous individuals from other countries
07:36and many of them are illiterate
07:39and many of them don't speak Spanish,
07:41let alone English.
07:42So to be able to communicate to them
07:44is quite important in their own languages,
07:47particularly in an oral fashion
07:49and then on the right hand side shows
07:51about domestic workers.
07:52Also domestic workers are also
07:55along with an undocumented farm workers
07:58are often asked to enter mandatory evacuation zones,
08:02when the rest of the general public is asked
08:05to leave and flee for public health
08:06and safety issues.
08:07These individuals are asked to go
08:09into evacuation zones
08:10either if there's a domestic worker trying
08:12to get some of the goods and services,
08:15the goods that are in that house
08:18or undocumented workers
08:20that have to go into the fields
08:21to harvest the crops to protect them
08:25from smoking ash that are coming down.
08:27So it's a lot of inequalities
08:29about individual
08:30and oftentimes, these undocumented workers
08:33cannot file restitution or claims for,
08:37again, fear of deportation.
08:40So quick roadmap of what I'll be covering today
08:42is understanding well fire and inequality,
08:45an overview of the Thomas wildfire
08:47and its impact on undocumented immigrants
08:50and then broader policy implications
08:52and recommendations based on the research
08:54that we did as a community based project again.
08:57According to a recent Proceedings
08:59of the National Academies,
09:00climate change is making wildfire season longer
09:03and more severe.
09:04On average wildfires
09:05in the western United States burn six times
09:08the acreage they did 45 years ago,
09:11in California, Sierra Nevada,
09:12the frequency of wildfires since 1970,
09:15has increased by 256%,
09:18as the mountain snowpack melts earlier
09:21and the fire season extends year around,
09:24here it shows that 50 of the 20 largest wildfire
09:29by acreage in California has incurred since 2000
09:33and then you see here in this graphic
09:35that was done earlier in the year
09:37on the Thomas wildfire,
09:38which happened in December 2017
09:40and ended 40 days later in January 2018.
09:44It was the second largest wildfire
09:46until July of this year
09:49but then all the wildfires happen in California
09:53and it got knocked down to six in this graph
09:56and there's a new updated table
09:58that has a Thomas Fire number Seven
10:01as the seventh largest wildfire by acreage,
10:04so in just three months five other wildfires
10:10overtook the Thomas wildfire as being the largest,
10:14so the intensity and severity
10:15of wildfires are happening more and more
10:18here in California.
10:20While climate scientists expect wildfires
10:22to become more frequent and severe,
10:24it is important to explore how some people
10:26and communities are more affected
10:28by these events and others.
10:30Differences in human vulnerability
10:32to wildfire stem from a range of social,
10:34economic, historical and political factors.
10:37These factors include unequal access
10:40to disaster preparedness, knowledge
10:41and resources, contrasts and legacies
10:44of forest management practices,
10:46an expansion of residential development
10:48into the wildland.
10:50Researchers at the University of Washington
10:52recently analyzed
10:54the unequal vulnerability of wildfires
10:56for communities of color,
10:58they use the social ecological approach
11:00to determine wildfire vulnerability
11:02across 70,000 census tracts in the United States.
11:07This map here shows wildfire potential,
11:09as determined by the US Forest Service
11:11by census tract
11:13and they're by and there's 29 million people
11:16that are vulnerable to a wildfire
11:18throughout the United States
11:20and this again, it's only based on landscape risk,
11:23that means how close you live next to a forest
11:25or some type of landscape
11:27that can catch on fire
11:28and does not look at social demographics
11:31or what we call social vulnerability.
11:34The second map,
11:35however, takes into account
11:36both landscape wildfire risk
11:38and socio-economic factors
11:40to determine how likely an area's to adapt to
11:43and recover from a wildfire.
11:45They measure it by using data
11:46from the 2014 census census on race,
11:50income, language, education, housing,
11:53and several other factors.
11:55The research has found that communities
11:56of color specifically those census tracts
11:59within majority black, Latino,
12:01or Native American, are 50% more vulnerable
12:05to wildfires compared to other census tracts.
12:08This research shows that the 29 million Americans
12:11who live in areas with significant chance
12:14of extreme wildfires are white
12:17and social economically secure.
12:19Traditional analysis often obscure the fact
12:22that black Latino
12:23and Native American people have worse prospects
12:25for recovery from wildfire.
12:28In California,
12:29while many of these fire prone places
12:32are largely populated by higher income groups,
12:36they are also include hundreds of thousands
12:38of low income individuals
12:39who lack the resources
12:43to prepare or recover from the wildfire.
12:45These numbers will likely surge according
12:47to the California fourth Climate Assessment Report,
12:51which projects at the state's wildfire burn area
12:54will increase by 77% by the end of the century.
12:58The State of California
12:59recently just updated their own maps
13:03to include social vulnerability
13:05but until recently,
13:07they did not have any wildfire maps
13:10based on social vulnerability.
13:12Understanding social vulnerability,
13:14particularly for undocumented immigrants
13:16is important because even existing social border
13:19building maps such as the one we see here
13:21by the University of Washington are still inadequate.
13:24If we zero in on the communities
13:27and counties of Santa Barbara and Ventura County,
13:30it shows that it has a low level
13:33of social vulnerability to wildfire.
13:35That's because there's a high level
13:36of high income individuals in Santa Barbara Ventura
13:39and moreover, because undocumented immigrants
13:42are often undercounted in the US Census,
13:45so it doesn't accurately show
13:47that the level of social vulnerability
13:49doesn't have that a contextual,
13:51what they call contextual vulnerability analysis,
13:56identifying those
13:57that are most socially vulnerable,
13:58it's important because in California Rural low income
14:01and immigrant communities,
14:02residents often do not have the required resources
14:05to pay for insurance, rebuild
14:08or to invest in fire safety,
14:10which increases their vulnerability to wildfire.
14:14Such outcomes occurring during
14:16and after wildfires
14:17have major environmental justice implications
14:20and that certain populations
14:21due to their socio economic status,
14:23must live with the disproportionate share
14:26of environmental impacts
14:27and suffer the related public health
14:29and quality of life burdens.
14:32In a few moments,
14:33I'm gonna jump into the case study
14:36and look at the disaster impacts
14:39from the Thomas wildfire,
14:41but first, I would like to provide some background
14:43on the fire and some demographics
14:46on undocumented immigrants in the region.
14:49On December 4th, 2017,
14:52the Thomas Fire started north of the city
14:54of Santa Paula and Ventura County,
14:56it grew quickly to nearly 31,000 acres
14:59or 50 square miles
15:00in less than 12 hours,
15:02its explosive growth was driven
15:04by a combination of climactic events
15:06including dry foliage, low humidity
15:09and intense Santa Ana winds
15:11that gusted up to 60 miles per hour.
15:13At the time of final containment
15:15on January 20th, 2018,
15:1840 days later,
15:19the Thomas Fire would be classified
15:21as a second largest wildfire
15:23in California's history.
15:24The firestorm affected hundreds of thousands
15:27of residents in the counties of Ventura
15:29and Santa Barbara,
15:30resulting in massive blackouts,
15:32destruction of over 1000 buildings
15:34and the fatality of one firefighter,
15:37media outlets across the country focus
15:39on news reports and loss of coastal
15:42and hillside mansions
15:43and impacts to wealthy farm owners and homeowners.
15:47The Thomas Fire however,
15:48not only destroyed expensive property and crops
15:51but it also endanger the health
15:53and livelihood of thousands
15:54of undocumented immigrants.
15:56California is home
15:58to an estimated 2.5 million undocumented immigrants,
16:01many of whom are foreign workers
16:02or employed in service jobs
16:05such as housekeeping and landscaping.
16:07In Ventura and Santa Barbara Counties
16:09undocumented immigrants are estimated
16:12to account for more than 9%
16:14of the total population or 111,000 people.
16:17So Ventura and Santa Barbara counties
16:20are heavily fire prone and drought impacted area,
16:23the landscape and between mountains
16:25and oceans creates vulnerabilities
16:27and housing, transportation
16:29and the infrastructure in the region.
16:31It's a major agricultural
16:33and tourism industries with low rates immigrant workforce
16:38and there's a high level racial
16:40and economic inequality and a lack of political
16:43and economic inclusion.
16:49While relief efforts
16:50in the Thomas Fire have largely been praised
16:52as effective, immigrant workers
16:55were especially impacted from the fire
16:56due to the loss of employment,
16:58the lack of evacuation information
17:01in their native language,
17:02confusion about eligibility
17:04for Disaster Relief Services
17:06and port infrastructure and housing
17:08in immigrant communities,
17:09undocumented immigrants socio-economic situation
17:12is usually precarious.
17:14However, that wildfire disaster intensified
17:16they're already difficult situation.
17:18The Thomas Fire reviewed revealed
17:21how undocumented immigrants
17:23and those with seasonal work via visas
17:25require special consideration
17:27and disaster planning.
17:29These individuals are often afraid
17:31to seek help and restitution during
17:33and after a wildfire disaster
17:36for fear of deportation,
17:37undocumented immigrants are also unable
17:40to access Disaster Relief Services
17:42because of language barriers
17:43and prohibition
17:44from assessing federal disaster
17:46relief assistant programes.
17:48On this picture
17:49shows the two community research partners
17:51that I work with on this co-authored
17:53the Mixteco Indigina Community Organizing Project
17:56or MICOP
17:57and that's a picture of Genevieve Flores-Haro,
18:01one of the co-authors,
18:02she's holding in her hands,
18:04a couple boxes of N95 masks
18:07that they were distributing to farm workers
18:10because employers
18:11and supervisors were not providing PPEE
18:13on even though there was a toxic smoke circulated
18:17in air as these these workers laboured
18:20into the fields.
18:21Also on the right hand side is the other committee
18:24to co-author on the Central Coast Alliance United
18:26for a Sustainable Economy,
18:28that's Lucas Zucker
18:29and you see he's on top of empty boxes
18:31of thousands of N95 masks
18:34that were distributed because the county,
18:36the government, the federal government,
18:38as well as supervisors
18:40and farm owners did not pass these out.
18:50Governments in the region overlook the needs
18:52of low income farmers, Spanish
18:54and indigenous Mixtecal speakers
18:56and immigrant families.
18:58Ventura and Santa Barbara counties are both home
19:01to a growing indigenous Mexican population.
19:03It is estimated that over 25,000 indigenous Oaxacan people
19:07from southern Mexico live
19:09and work in Ventura County.
19:10Well, Santa Barbara County is home
19:12to a population estimated at 29,000,
19:15concentrated in labour intensive sectors such as row crops
19:19and cut flowers, indigenous migrants
19:21performing an increasing amount
19:23of the arduous labour
19:24which contributes to the profitability
19:26and affordability of fresh fruits and vegetables.
19:29In particular, Mixtec people
19:30in Ventura County are culturally
19:32and linguistically isolated.
19:34Many are illiterate
19:36and most speak neither Spanish nor English
19:39but only their native language Mixtecal
19:41which is only oral.
19:43It is important to note
19:44that Mixtec people are not Hispanic
19:46or Latino but are indigenous.
19:48They're often homogenized
19:50with the general Latino population.
19:55The fact that they often cannot communicate
19:57with people
19:58beyond their own indigenous communities
19:59and pizza building,
20:00obtain appropriate health care, housing,
20:02education, negotiate with their employers
20:05to improve their work situation
20:07and exercise their basic civil rights,
20:10with these variables in mind,
20:11our research adopts the work in the field
20:14of public health
20:14that examines issues
20:16of intersectionality,
20:18that is how social categories
20:20such as gender, class, race, indigeneity,
20:24immigration status
20:25and other class aspects of human identity
20:27intersect with wildfire disaster.
20:30The concept of intersectionality has been used
20:33to highlight how these categories of culture
20:36and identity overlap hiding in
20:38the effects of discrimination,
20:40exclusion, social inequality
20:42and systemic injustice in the lives
20:45of specific individuals,
20:46an intersectional approach to wildfire disaster,
20:49it emphasizes how certain people
20:52and groups suffer worse effects
20:54because of overlapping factors
20:56that are often measured separately
21:00and this respect,
21:01we define social vulnerability to welfare
21:03as comprised of the risk of exposure,
21:05the likelihood that people
21:07will be affected, sensitivity,
21:09the degree to which people will be affected
21:12and adaptive capacity,
21:13the ability of people to prepare
21:15and, or recover from a wildfire
21:18based on available resources.
21:22Moreover, we ask the question
21:24of what does adaptive capacity mean
21:25for migrant communities?
21:27Most of the literature on adapting communities
21:29to wildfire focuses
21:30on redesigning communities focus on homeowners,
21:34how can we design our homes and buildings
21:36through land use and building codes
21:38but what does this mean
21:39to migrant undocumented communities
21:42on terms of language access,
21:44worker health and safety rights,
21:46immigration status and access
21:47to disaster relief
21:49and housing and transportation impacts.
21:53So now I'm finally gonna jump
21:55into some of the impacts
21:56that were present through the Thomas wildfire.
22:00There was an equity in terms of language access
22:03to Emergency Information,
22:05while this area has a large proportion
22:09of Latino and Hispanic individuals
22:12that speak Spanish in the area
22:13and have been living here for generations.
22:16The counties of interest Santa Barbara counties
22:18did not have anyone in their emergency services
22:21to do live translations,
22:24so that the fire raged on for nearly 10 days
22:28and there was no translation
22:30of Emergency Information
22:31that included advisory alerts
22:33about poor air quality,
22:36about sheltering about emergency evacuations
22:39about boiler or alerts.
22:41What they did on the fourth day
22:43is put a Google Translate tool on top
22:45in their websites
22:46as well as on top of Emergency Information
22:51and it had one sentence in Spanish
22:53that read that if you don't speak English,
22:56please take this Emergency Information note
22:59to somebody that can translate it for you
23:02and then the Google Translate
23:04at the time this was about three years ago
23:06was not as refined as it is today
23:09and when you would type in a wildfire,
23:13it would be translated as hairbrush
23:16so there was a lot of inequities that occurred,
23:20it took about 10 days
23:21for the state of California to land somebody
23:26from the Governor's Office of Emergency services
23:28to help do light translations
23:31but in the interim,
23:32MICOP and CAUSE the two communities organizations
23:35had to do all the translations
23:37in their social media platforms.
23:39They have a low power radio station,
23:42that they're able to translate in Spanish
23:45and Mixtecal
23:46and a couple other other commonly spoken languages
23:48in the area
23:52and as you can see,
23:52these are some of the air quality advisories
23:56in the wildfire in Ventura,
23:58the maroon and dark purple areas
24:01is where a lot of the farms are working
24:03and these are mandatory evacuation zones
24:07but oftentimes, still,
24:09farm workers are still entering
24:11into these mandatory evacuation zones
24:13to work in and protect some of the crops
24:16from smoke and ash.
24:18As you see from here,
24:19there's a safe drinking water access.
24:21So none of this was translated
24:23for nearly two weeks
24:25and MICOP through the radio station
24:29and other social communication platforms was able
24:32to translate that
24:34and get it to about 30,000 people in the region.
24:38The community, as I mentioned before,
24:40had to step up
24:40because there was no official government response.
24:44Even though these individuals
24:45have been living here for four generations.
24:48As the counties there Santa Barbara, Ventura
24:52and even the state decided not to invest
24:56any resources ahead of disasters
24:59and protecting the socially vulnerable community.
25:04So they had a lot of hazard
25:05and mitigation plans in effect,
25:08but none of them talked about social vulnerability
25:10and specifically undocumented immigrants
25:13and farm workers
25:15and one of the major impacts was worker health
25:18and safety impacts
25:19as I showed in the previous slides,
25:21MICOP and CAUSE had to distribute PP equipment
25:25because this was not provided
25:27by the state county governments,
25:29let alone their employers.
25:31So they got some funds donated
25:35from private and other government sources
25:38to go and purchase some of these N95 masks,
25:41goggles and gloves as well
25:44and here are some of the interviews
25:46that we did from our research.
25:48Some of the farm workers,
25:49a farm worker from Oxford told us
25:50during the fire I worked three days
25:50without a mask.
25:51It caused me headaches and watery eyes
25:52as well as a cough.
25:53We were scared
25:54because we were very near
25:55where the fire was occurring.
25:55The masks were not handed out
25:56until the city came to regulate.
25:57Another farm worker told us,
25:58we all got sick our throats closed
25:59in from breathing too much smoke
26:00and our kids couldn't go to school.
26:00We had to buy mask and medicine for our throats
26:01and some goggles because my eyes were irritated
26:02when I worked.
26:03There was also economic
26:04and health impacts on workers,
26:05in particular, some of these farms did burn down
26:05or it was just too hazardous to go work
26:06so they were shut down.
26:07So a lot of people lost income
26:08and a waste to support their family as well.
26:09There was black and there was mudslides
26:10after the fires that occurred finished
26:10in mid January,
26:11there was a torrential rains that came
26:12and created mudslides,
26:13major mudslides that that were caused
26:14from the fire debris as well
26:15and that also killed additional people
26:15that will we'll be speaking about come shortly.
26:16A domestic worker service workers
26:17also were impacted.
26:18Some of these mansions
26:19in the states were burned down
26:20to the ground and he did not have any sources
26:20of income as as undocumented migrants there
26:21during eligible for unemployment relief funds
26:22as well as a federal disaster relief funds.
26:23One of our informants one of the people
26:24we interviewed also told us
26:25about the neck Woody's that were happening.
26:25For instance, one of the domestic workers told us
26:26as well as the Los Angeles Times
26:27that while her her employer threat fled the home
26:28because it was a mandatory evacuation zone,
26:29she asked a domestic worker to stay
26:30and safeguard the house
26:30and to be able to get a couple items
26:31if the fire would get too close to the house.
26:32So these individuals were asked,
26:33not forced but asked and pressure
26:34to stay in mandatory fire evacuation zone.
26:35Here's some additional quotes
26:35from one landscaper in Santa Barbara.
26:36I could not get to the homes
26:37where I work because the streets were close
26:38to the homes I worked at were destroyed.
26:39One of my good friends was lost
26:40during the most mudflow.
26:40He had only been living in Montecito
26:41for three weeks before he died.
26:42I myself a cancer survivor
26:43and the only one who provides for the family.
26:44Another worker told us the day
26:45of the fire started the sky was covered with smoke
26:45and we were sent home.
26:46The next day we didn't work
26:47because it was dangerous due to the fire.
26:48We lost power because it was cut off
26:49by the fire and we lost food
26:50and melt for our kids. During the mudslides.
26:50We couldn't get to work
26:51and we're told to stay home for two days.
26:52As I mentioned before immigration status
26:53and disaster aid really limits people's
26:54in adaptive capacity,
26:55how they're going to bounce back
26:55from the disaster and recover,
26:56so that they're not provided
26:57with government resources
26:58even though they're contributing to the economy
26:59in our society.
27:00As a result, migrant rights groups
27:00and other social justice
27:01and nonprofit groups in the region
27:02create the 805 undock cufon this was modelled off
27:03of the original undocumented Sonoma
27:04and Napa County for the fires
27:05that happen on about six months earlier on
27:05and so this was modelled after Napa Sonoma
27:06and as you can see from here
27:07on total relief was provided
27:08to nearly 2000 families
27:09on almost 4000 undocumented people
27:10and over 7000 mixed status individuals
27:10and over $2 million has been raised
27:11on their continued to raise as these fires
27:12and other COVID-19 persists
27:13and but often there's a waiting list
27:14because there's not enough funding on
27:15to support all undocumented families
27:15that want to be supported through the spine.
27:16It's important to note that these mix families
27:17that mix families should not have to go
27:18to a private disaster relief fund like this
27:19but many are for fear of on deportation
27:20because even though a mixed family is a family
27:20that has a US resident or US citizen
27:21and but there's also undocumented migrants
27:22within that household living
27:23in the same household
27:24and so they're eligible
27:25but by being residents or US citizens
27:25but under the Trump administration
27:26as you fill out, these FEMA forms,
27:27there is a disclosure there that states
27:28that this information may
27:29or may be shared with ice,
27:30which is immigration and customs,
27:30Customs and Immigration Services.
27:31So that really scares some families
27:32that are eligible for federal disaster relief
27:33from accessing it.
27:34So that that that sense of fear
27:35and sharing of information with ice is intentional
27:35and really continue contributes
27:36to the rendering on this population invisible.
27:37Here's another quote
27:38on regarding the undocumented.
27:39My husband was deported,
27:40just before the fire,
27:40I was really struggling to find work in the fields.
27:41I finally got hired the first week
27:42in December 2017
27:43but was let go once the fire
27:44and smoke grew too big
27:45and in the fruit spoil
27:45as the only breadwinner,
27:46I had to borrow money from friends
27:47and family to feed my kids.
27:48Our food went bad due to the power outage
27:49adding to our expenses.
27:50I am grateful for the DOC UFA,
27:50Funding Assistance,
27:51I am still in need to help
27:52and continue coming to MICOP for other services.
27:53There was also a loss of regional housing stock.
27:54So it wasn't just manage mega mansions
27:55and wealthy individuals.
27:55There was also housing stock lost
27:56and some parts of Santa Barbara
27:57that were multi family housing
27:58but any California as you may know,
27:59like San Francisco, on the Central Coast,
28:00Santa Barbara,
28:00in particular has an affordable housing crunch.
28:01So any loss of housing has an impact
28:02throughout the region,
28:03as people have to move to other housing,
28:04to replace their homes.
28:05So that increases the price
28:05as a rental market and price gouging.
28:06So there was instances
28:07in some of these communities
28:08in East Santa Barbara
28:09where many of the workers live,
28:10you had one large landowner,
28:10increasing rent by at least $300.
28:11So there's a lot in equity
28:12in terms of housing stock,
28:13the protests essentially happened
28:14after that price gouging
28:15but this is an occurrence
28:15that happens particularly a lot in undocumented,
28:16migrant communities.
28:17The land owners know
28:18that they're often these individuals
28:19are not going to tell the government
28:20and so they feel that they can get away with this.
28:20There was also loss of transportation infrastructure.
28:21This is a picture
28:22of the one on one freeway one one highway.
28:23So this is the major arterial highway
28:27connecting Ventura County
28:29to Santa Barbara County,
28:34as I mentioned before the oceans on one side
28:35and then you have large mountains
28:37on the other side.
28:38So this is one of the most efficient,
28:53affordable ways to to reach Santa Barbara
29:06and Ventura counties
29:13but at the fire and the mudslides
29:15on blocked access
29:16to this area so workers could not get to work.
29:20So if you didn't have funds
29:21to find alternative forms of transportation,
33:32then you were really very out of luck
33:33and it was a situation
33:36where you would lose more income.
33:38So people with higher incomes were able
33:40to rent boats,
33:42they actually rented boats
33:43to get around the highway,
33:45other people bought expensive Amtrak tickets
33:49and then finally other people drove
33:51all the way around the mountains
33:52which took a lot much longer,
33:54a lot more gas to to get around
33:56but many undocumented immigrants don't have
33:58that extra cash
33:59to do these alternative transportation modes
34:03and then, looking at the limitations,
34:06now I wanna jump
34:07into sort of the policy implications
34:08of some of our research
34:10and particularly the limits
34:11of vulnerability mapping,
34:14current social vulnerability
34:15mapping renders many minority
34:18and poor communities of color invisible.
34:21For example, the University of Washington map
34:24shows Santa Barbara and Ventura counties
34:26as having low levels of social vulnerability
34:28due to the large proportion
34:30of economically secure households in the region,
34:33however as we've shown in our research,
34:35Latino and indigenous migrant communities
34:38were among the most impacted
34:40during the Thomas Fire.
34:41Moreover, immigration status
34:43has received little attention
34:44and disaster vulnerability mapping.
34:47Though a large proportion
34:48of disaster studies have considered race
34:50and ethnicity as the vulnerability factor
34:53impacts experienced by migrants
34:55require an intersectional research approach.
35:00Current vulnerability mapping approach
35:02also fails to account for the complex web
35:05of impacts caused by disasters
35:07far beyond destruction of property
35:09within the perimeter of the fire itself.
35:11Toxic smoke flows down from burning mountainside,
35:14settling in densely populated valleys
35:16below threatening outdoor workers,
35:18lavish hillside mansions are destroyed
35:20or evacuated, leaving low income migrant gardeners,
35:25housekeepers and caregivers unemployed.
35:27Tourism throughout the region shuts down
35:30putting thousands of hotel employees out of work.
35:32From the loss of housing
35:33and infrastructure to the closure of schools
35:35and job sites,
35:37multiple regions are impacted
35:39beyond the census tracts
35:40identified in mapping models
35:41of buyer landscape risk zones.
35:44For example, a low income migrant family
35:47living outside of Bern area
35:48whose loses several weeks of wages
35:51without eligibility for federal
35:53and state assistance may be more negatively
35:55impacted than a higher income homeowner
35:58who lives within the fire risk zone
36:01whose property is replaced
36:02by their homeowners insurance policy,
36:04which also pays for hotel commendations
36:07for them to stay in the interim.
36:13The policy implication here
36:15that I wanna drive home really
36:18is that existing inequalities are exacerbated
36:20during the disasters
36:21because there is no existing social safety net
36:24before a disaster to protect these individuals.
36:27So Disaster Risk Reduction must start
36:30with social integration of migrants
36:31before a disaster.
36:35So the COVID-19 pandemic,
36:36I could talk a little bit more
36:37about this in the Q&A, has really decimated
36:41some of these communities
36:43but this Thomas Fire
36:45that happened was three years ago
36:47and the fires in Northern California, Sonoma,
36:51Napa County happened about three years ago as well
36:56and is since those fires
36:58that continue to happen
36:59these regions have become a little bit more
37:03proactive in disaster planning,
37:04particularly groups like MICOP
37:06and other migrant rights groups
37:08have really asserted their rights
37:09to speak as disaster experts
37:13and really have demanded to be
37:15in some of these county
37:16and state government meetings as stakeholders
37:19and disaster planning.
37:21So infrastructure through protests
37:23and advocacy has expanded
37:26to be able to provide more adequate resources
37:30to individuals during disasters and pandemics
37:33and as I talked to some of these migrant groups,
37:36they all tell me that
37:37while the COVID-19 pandemic has decimated
37:41those communities had it not been
37:43for the planning after the wildfires,
37:45disasters and these farm worker communities,
37:48the COVID-19 pandemic would have been far worse
37:51because they had at least three years
37:53to become experts and demand resources
37:57from the state and local governments.
38:00So the broader policy implication
38:03of this research
38:04is to ensure inclusive disaster planning
38:07that we must draw on migrant community knowledge,
38:10embrace migrant communities
38:11and disaster planning, response
38:13and recovery and bolster a lot
38:15of next indigenous civil society organizations capacity
38:18in disaster relief and planning efforts.
38:22So some outcomes that happened
38:24since a Thomas wildfire California
38:27has adopted some very culturally
38:30and linguistically
38:31inclusive disaster planning resources
38:35requiring county and state governments
38:39to provide language access
38:41to Emergency Information
38:43and that's also contingent disaster relief aid.
38:47So if you want state disaster relief aid,
38:49you have to update your protocols
38:51on disaster planning and your language access
38:55and there's also been funding tied
38:58to cultural competency and disaster planning
39:00and climate resilient planning.
39:02So these local governments have to show
39:04how they're proactively working
39:05with socially vulnerable communities
39:07ahead of disaster and to their mitigation
39:09that hazard mitigation plans.
39:12Some of the recommendations,
39:13we end our research with that
39:14there should be a state wide Disaster Relief Fund
39:17for all regardless of immigration status.
39:19It's inequitable that civil society,
39:22particularly migrant organizations
39:26that have little resources have to extend
39:28so much of their capital
39:31and fundraising efforts
39:33to safeguard these communities
39:35when this should be the role
39:36of the state government.
39:37There should also be emergency funding
39:39for CBOs on the ground working
39:42with these communities.
39:43Again, they have little resources,
39:48state and local governments
39:49need to develop new methods
39:50to map socially vulnerable communities
39:52as I showed from the University of Washington
39:54on social vulnerability mapping,
39:56which is a great tool,
39:58but it still renders some communities invisible
40:00such as undocumented immigrants
40:02and into codified into law protections
40:05from wildfire smoke right now,
40:07advocates was able to work
40:10with the State Board of Occupational Health
40:13and Safety to do an emergency regulation
40:16for wildfire smoke.
40:18So when the air quality reaches 151 index,
40:23employers are required
40:24to provide a PPE N95 respirator masks
40:29but that's temporary
40:30and it's really been uneven up
40:32how this is enforced
40:34and this should be codified into law.
40:37So, I also had spoken to some individuals
40:41in Sonoma throughout the Central Coast
40:43that experienced fires on this past summer
40:48and they also account
40:49that there's an uneven N95 mass implementation
40:53throughout the state
40:54and in fact,
40:56the State Office of Occupational Health and Safety
40:59only has about a dozen Spanish speaking,
41:02individuals that go out in the field
41:04to do investigations on complaints
41:06and compliance with this.
41:08As far as I know,
41:09they don't have anyone
41:10that speaks indigenous languages,
41:11so there's only about 12
41:13or so people in the entire state of California,
41:16there's a state of 40 million people,
41:19only about 12 of them speak Spanish
41:21that work in the field.
41:22So there's a course on even implementation
41:25of the role on the air quality index
41:27that I mentioned about the wildfire smoke,
41:31there's uncertainty about how this is being achieved.
41:35Oftentimes, these air quality monitoring stations,
41:38our government monitoring stations
41:39are often miles away
41:41from the actual farm worker site.
41:43So you may have a 151 index
41:46about five miles away at air quality station
41:49but that index could be much higher
41:52at the field next,
41:53that's happening near closer to the fire.
41:56So there needs to be opportunities
41:57to have real time handheld
42:00GPS type of air quality monitoring
42:03that these individuals
42:04and employers should be using
42:07instead of having for a wait up there
42:09monitoring stations.
42:11There's no state guidance on implementation
42:13of worker health and safety
42:15there's little guidance on that
42:17and one issue that's happening now,
42:19particularly in Sonoma
42:21is these access verification permits
42:23that allows farm workers
42:24to enter into mandatory evacuation zones over 400,
42:28I believe was issued
42:30by the Sonoma County Agricultural Commissioner
42:35and this essentially allows foreign workers
42:37to enter these mandatory evacuation zones
42:39when everyone else is required to leave
42:42and these supervisors,
42:44the employers themselves
42:45do not have any emergency plans.
42:47So if the fire gets close to the farm worker site
42:51or more toxic smoke overtakes the entire farm,
42:55how are they gonna evacuate the farm workers
42:58in a swift and safe fashion?
43:02And moreover,
43:02there's no health test for these workers.
43:04So we don't know,
43:06what is the risk of working
43:08in this wildfire smoke itself
43:13as you know, is hazardous to human health
43:16but it's not only just the smoke itself
43:18is the other types of toxins
43:20that are missing from the burden buildings
43:22that are in individuals.
43:24So there's no follow up on workers testing
43:28to find out calm how they're doing
43:30after entering these mandatory evacuation zones
43:34and again, Cal/OSHA has limited staff,
43:37as I mentioned before
43:40and there I'll be able to open up to questions
43:45and I look forward
43:46to hearing your questions and comments.
43:48This is just a quick slide
43:50that we recently did in October
43:53with the governor's office
43:55and the United Nations.
43:56So the United Nations Intergovernmental Panel,
44:00excuse me,
44:01the United Nations International Organization
44:05on Migration hosted a panel with ourselves
44:09as well as the California governor's office
44:12on Emergency Services to talk
44:15about what the rest of the world could learn
44:18from the migrant experience in California
44:20because these disasters
44:21because of climate change is making the severity
44:23of these disasters more frequent and severe,
44:26it's happening in Australia,
44:27it's happening in Latin America,
44:29it's happening in Greece
44:31and migrant communities are all these places.
44:34So the idea was to understand
44:36what can the rest of the world learn
44:37from the migrant wildfire disaster
44:40experienced in California?
44:42With that, I thank you for this opportunity
44:45and look forward to speaking with you
44:48about this research.
44:51- Thank you, Michael,
44:52so, wonderful presentation.
44:55I know we do have a lot of questions coming
44:57in the chat box.
44:59So the first question is from Rebecca Hoffler,
45:04she's asking,
45:05are there any translation technologies available
45:09to help overcome these niche language barriers
45:12for migrants?
45:15I had no idea many were not Spanish speaking
45:18that is so crucial to them might be a quote,
45:20tech or high education punishing
45:23to do app that tech.
45:24I know you mentioned about the Google translator
45:26but any others?
45:29Yeah, there's a couple that are there
45:32but again, the owner should not be put
45:34on the individual,
45:36the individual resident worker
45:38or community based organization,
45:40the owners needs to be on local
45:43and state government and federal government
45:45to provide the resources
45:46to safeguard all community residents,
45:49regardless of immigration status.
45:51So these individuals are important contributors
45:54to our society, they make fresh fruits
45:57and vegetables available for us
45:59and do some of the important work
46:01as essential workers,
46:03but yet, we don't value them enough to safeguard.
46:06So that's why I had mentioned
46:09that systemic racism
46:10and cultural norms of around immigration
46:13determines who's the worthy disaster victim.
46:16So yes, that's great in terms of the interim,
46:18but local governments
46:20that have this type of workforce
46:22in their area needs to dedicate resources
46:26for live translation
46:28and have staffing a place like California,
46:31everyone think California is so progressive
46:34but here's a situation
46:35where a population, two populations
46:38are overlooked Spanish
46:39and indigenous speaking individuals
46:41are entirely rendered invisible.
46:45- Well, thanks, we also actually have a lot
46:47of questions pre-collected from the students
46:52and they are quite interested
46:55in are there any quantitative evidence
46:59showing the vulnerability
47:00of these undocumented Latino from the research?
47:06- So right now,
47:07there's social vulnerability mapping.
47:10There's some great models
47:11with the work the University of Washington did,
47:13it is great
47:14but right now, there's, that I'm aware of,
47:17there's no new models
47:18that takes into account undocumented immigrants
47:22and right now that that would take
47:24a very well thought out a research designed
47:29and human subjects protocol process
47:35and working closely
47:36to do what you call ground truth
47:38and working with hand in hand
47:39with these migrant organizations
47:41to identify individuals
47:42or where they may be in general
47:44'Cause you don't obviously don't want it
47:45to be too specific because of ice
47:47and Immigration Services
47:50but enough where it is,
47:51you can identify it broadly in a region
47:55because right now,
47:56as you saw in Ventura, Santa Barbara
47:58and other places in California too
48:00and I'm guessing in the United States
48:03as well as the current indices,
48:07basically whitewash these communities.
48:11- Okay, I think so.
48:13Another question from the audience is from Joseph
48:19and I guess he's asking,
48:22has research investigated the possibility
48:25of training community health advocates
48:28within the indigenous communities
48:31so as to improve utilization
48:33and access to social services,
48:35health care, and disaster relief information?
48:39- Yeah, so that's I mentioned a very briefly
48:41about the COVID-19 pandemic,
48:44it's been three years since Thomas wildfire
48:47and about three years three and a half years,
48:49since the first major recent fire
48:53in Northern California
48:55and those far more regions
48:56and these advocates have become disaster experts
49:01in their own, not by choice,
49:04they were forced to become this
49:05because this is the constituency
49:07that they advocate and protect
49:09and you see migrant rights
49:11whose immigration rights group are working
49:13on climate change now working
49:14because there's a strong sort of the cyclical process.
49:19A lot of these individuals
49:20are leaving their countries
49:23to some extent climate refugees
49:24with a drought soil erosion
49:26in their ancestral homeland,
49:29particularly for people (indistinct)
49:32that come to United States
49:34and then they come over here
49:35and it's a different types
49:37of climate change impacts
49:38that are happening to them.
49:41So you see these groups be more active
49:44in non-traditional immigration
49:47priority topics such as the environment
49:49and now disaster.
49:50So these individuals are part
49:51of what's Vlad, what's enough,
49:54volunteers organized for assistance and disaster
49:57or something
49:58and so the several other roundtables around disaster
50:03and particularly the Red Cross
50:06and Salvation Army,
50:07they also have their own private,
50:10mainstream disaster relief systems.
50:12So these individuals are now brought in
50:14to those discussions
50:16that these disaster relief organizations have,
50:20as well as state and local government
50:24- There is a question from the students,
50:26I'm glad you mentioned that COVID-19 situation
50:30and listeners are wondering,
50:32that does the COVID-19 disaster relief assistance
50:35for immigrants help make the case
50:38that the states really need to put funding
50:40for health care coverage
50:42for this and also rights, workers?
50:45- Yeah, so two things happen
50:46in California first important
50:48to know about COVID-19,
50:49about language information that happens
50:52and the language we stick on.
50:54There's no word for virus,
50:56so they had to come up
50:58with different types of both oral
51:01and pictorial on messaging
51:03that talked about it and not COVID-19
51:06but an unknown illness
51:08and disease in that region,
51:10to be able to convey that.
51:11So that's one thing is having culturally sensitive
51:14and culturally appropriate messaging
51:17on Emergency Information is important
51:19and they have built up somewhat of a capacity
51:22to be able to do that now
51:24and work in partnership with the state government
51:26and because of the advocacy these groups have done,
51:28as well as the importance
51:31of the California Latino Legislative Caucus,
51:34so that the Latino Legislative Caucus,
51:36it is a caucus of Latinos,
51:39a lot of next legislators
51:41that work in the California State Legislature
51:43and there are a big number now
51:45and they have put a lot of pressure
51:46along with advocates on the governor
51:49to be more responsive to migrant communities,
51:53particularly undocumented migrant communities
51:55and this summer,
51:57the governor put $50 million
52:00in a temporary Disaster Relief Fund
52:04and I believe
52:05the philanthropic community did another 25,
52:08so a total of 75 million that went
52:10for one type tax evasion to households,
52:13undocumented immigrant households,
52:15anywhere between 400 and $700, I believe
52:19but that money's already gone
52:20and $75 million sounds like a lot
52:21but that has been exhausted
52:24and it will go one time cash visa.
52:28- Thanks for the insights.
52:31From the audience
52:32there's also some question
52:34regarding the the other types
52:36of (indistinct) they meet
52:39because sending the these communities,
52:42from Leon Wesley, from Virginia is asking
52:45is there any data info regarding the safety
52:47of drinking water supplies
52:49for their factory workers
52:50and their living areas from this post fire
52:53your mom took us in?
52:56- Yeah, I'm a little bit aware of that,
53:01so the toxins, as I mentioned,
53:04mixing in the air,
53:05it's just not regular trees burning down
53:09but it's also all the materials
53:11that build our houses and our infrastructure
53:13that are quite toxic.
53:15So that not only goes into the air
53:17but that also goes into the water
53:19in terms of what they call the fire debris
53:23and the State Water Resources Control Board
53:26is currently looking at that
53:28in terms of maximum contaminant levels
53:31and sort of what regions
53:35and how these regions are being exposed
53:37to this fire debris
53:38in their community drinking water systems.
53:41So that's something
53:42that's currently being looked at.
53:44Yes, but I don't know
53:46how strong it's being regulated.
53:52- Thank you.
53:53So another question
53:55from the audience is kind of related
53:57to our earlier discussion
53:58regarding the tours for these committees,
54:04there is,
54:05Marcus from Andrea is asking your experience
54:09is having a digital healthcare a PP
54:12for these communities by lingo
54:15would that be helpful
54:17to have accessible primary care
54:19because these committees can have access
54:22to mobile technologies are the prepare handling,
54:26have these Wi-Fi
54:29and mobile technologies available?
54:33- I'm not sure entirely I understand that
54:36but the MICOP,
54:37the Mixtecal Indiana community organizing project
54:41they did have a very high social media presence
54:44and particularly WhatsApp
54:46as from what I learned
54:48from the recent and what I've been told,
54:50is very popular in migrant communities,
54:54particularly Mexican migrant communities.
54:56So they decimate information
54:59through WhatsApp, through their Instagram,
55:02their Facebook
55:04and I think they have another social media
55:06and then of course, the radio,
55:07the radio is a very simple one
55:10that individuals get a lot
55:12of their information from.
55:14- Thank you.
55:14I think given the time,
55:15we'll have the final last question,
55:17do we stop living later?
55:20The question combining
55:21from both the students asking
55:23and one of the audiences kinda asking
55:25about you have shown very powerful images,
55:29both in the paper and the presentation
55:31and telling the story
55:33of these workers were required
55:35to stay behind all gathering belong
55:38from the employers home
55:40despite this evacuation points.
55:43So some, like insights
55:46regarding how to help
55:48make these local employers accountable
55:52for putting workers
55:54in these dangerous situations.
55:55- Sure.
55:57I didn't get a chance to download this audio file
56:03because of the mix up in time
56:06but I want to talk first play this audio file
56:09real quick of what the Mixtec language sounds like.
56:12I'm sure there's many people
56:13that have never heard it before.
56:15(speaking foreign language)
56:32So as you can hear it,
56:35the language resembles nothing like Spanish.
56:38So that's a major issue on the daily
56:41with how to create connections
56:43and trust within these communities
56:45and deliver culturally appropriate language
56:50and the Emergency Information
56:52and I forgot what was the question again?
56:54- So the question is like,
56:56how the local organizations can help
57:03to hold the employers accountable
57:07for putting these workers
57:08in this dangerous places?
57:10- I think it's contingent advocacy
57:13and then the passage
57:15of some of these occupational health
57:17and safety rules,
57:19there obviously needs to be more done on
57:21as I mentioned before
57:22these access verification permits
57:25and it's sort of a black box
57:27about how the county agricultural Commissioner
57:30is issuing these permits to employers.
57:33So does any employer that request one gets one,
57:37are they looking at land fire risk zones
57:41and how close the proximity the fire
57:43is to the farm itself
57:44and again, the air quality issues
57:46and making sure that PP
57:48is being distributed properly and effectively
57:52because we saw instances
57:54in our own research that even at the time,
57:58this was three years ago,
57:59even at the time
57:59when people were donating these N95 mass
58:03some employers wouldn't give them out
58:05and there was other instances
58:07where my co-authors saw
58:09that they were giving it out only to men
58:11and not women.
58:13So there's a very uneven implementation
58:17of some of even the existing health
58:19and safety rules.
58:20So more needs to be done
58:21and there needs to be more transparency
58:24and accountability
58:25and as we have these workers working
58:28in these dangerous zones.
58:31- Thank you so much Michael
58:32for sharing all this kind of justice experience
58:36and thank you all the audience
58:38for joining us today
58:39and I think we'll end now, so bye everyone.
58:43Thank you, Michael. - Thank you, bye-bye.